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Opinion: Why go-arounds may need simplifying post-EK521

Enviado há
 
While the investigation into the Emirates Boeing 777 accident at Dubai is still active, the preliminary findings have already strongly signalled that one of these three critical parameters, thrust, was overlooked. (www.flightglobal.com) Mais...

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Highflyer1950
Highflyer1950 7
I think the reality today is who and what is controlling the aircraft and what is in place to identify quickly, the controlling entity. " We accept a visual approach, turn off the autopilot, and disengage the autothrottles but are we aware as pilots of what we just did? " KSFO, perfect example, hand fly the approach but assume the autothrust is still engaged, plane gets slow the pilot pulls back to shallow out the descent and waits for the thrust to kick in and it dosen't.....bang. OMDB, Crew for whatever reason, gets an aural warning just as the aircraft goes below 50, thrust at idle, initiates a go around by selectimg TOGA, raises the nose to go around attitude, recognizes a slight climb as positive rate, raises the gear (if the gear was ever down) and waits for spool up on the big turbines, they don't spool as fast as the crew would like so they push up the thrust levers but the aircraft settles back down, (speculation,of course) but what we need are flight crews that are fully competent in not only programming, hand flying, situational awareness but in full comprehension of all the systems and their interaction! Admittedly, the hardest missed approach is below 50' as the engines are brought to idle and the aircraft is in the preflare however, it will fly quite well with the gear hanging and the flaps at landing but wilth insufficient thrust, not so much. Sorry for the long dissertation.
joebrumm
Joseph Brummett 4
Bring the thrust to idle below 50 feet? I don't think so. You need to keep power on for two reason: 1. so you do't fall out of the sky 2. so the engines will spool up faster for a go around. I never brought the thrust to idle until touchdown.
dtw757
mike SUT 4
The only thing missing in this picture is prior planning. Every time I shot an approach, I had a plan in mind for a missed approach. Sometimes it doesn't all go as planned and you want to be ahead of the plane not so far behind it you don't get hurt in the accident. the I brief the FO..."if we need to go around...TOGA, YOU call positive rate and I will call for the gear. MAKE sure the missed approach altitude is set in the Mode control panel after we pass the Final Approach fix altitude." Going to go out on a limb here....bet the last step about the MA alt wasn't set. Those thrust levers in TOGA will follow the Flight Directors command right up to Alt Cap and if it was set for the airport elevation which I have SEEN foreign pilots on a visual do, the aircraft thinks it has arrived at the altitude you want and whatever your speed bug is at...that's all you're going to get (thrust levers back to idle) unless you get the Flight Directors off, and push the power back up. I'm guessing (said guessing) these guys weren't thinking of a 'What if" situation and when it happened were slow coming out of the gate JMHO
cwhitty07
cwhitty07 2
You're exactly right! Another thing to think of, is mindset. Just like you speculated about them not having the missed approach altitude set, they were probably surprised to do a go-around and had to mentally shift gears. When flying any take-off or approach and landing, my personal technique is to always be in the mindset that it is going to be aborted. When I push the thrust levers up to take off, my mind is thinking abort, unless the aircraft proves to me otherwise that it's safe to takeoff. That way when it happens, im not surprised and suddenly have to remember what to do. My mind is "primed" for the abort. Same thing goes with an instrument approach. I'm planning on not seeing the runway at minimums, just like in the sim.
sanukjim
James Wilson Jr -1
Mike SUT and Highflyer1950 ,sounds like you guys are military trained. Too bad all pilots aren't.
royhunte92
Roy Hunte 1
Still trying to figure out if they touched one bogie down or not, and if they did why not continue the landing.
tbpera
Tom Pera 5
scares me that so much is automated... false sense of security prevails.. too many old "fly the airplane" pilots retiring...
tduggan2010
Tim Duggan 3
I think go-arounds need to practiced more. One incident from several years ago sticks out. F/O was flying, still kinda new (B-757). Severe clear day at KLAS, runway 25L. Our company flight was ahead, and were taking their own sweet time clearing the runway....used ALL of it, in fact. I'm seeing this, and anticipating that the Tower was going to send us around. MY mistake was thinking the F/O understood it too....so I just ran thru, out loud, our procedure...."TOGA, flaps 15, Positive rate, Gear Up, check missed approach altitude". The F/O froze when Tower said "Go around". So NOW I'm the Flight Instructor coaching her thru it....and talking to ATC. AND? After we were well clear, and getting vectors to orbit and land on 19L...I casually mentioned that the A/P was available...the death grip on the control wheel relaxed, then.....well, it was a good landing. She needed a little coaxing and re-inforcement for confidence.....
joebrumm
Joseph Brummett 2
Same thing at same place happen to me in a B737-800. Only differences is that it was raining with a ceiling around 800 feet. Copilot was flying. Areo Mexico was ahead of us. From previous experience I new Aero Mexico would take up the entire runway. By mistake was not transmitting that thought to my First Officer. So when the Go Around came he was not ready. I talked him through it and it went smoothly.
vlfcrews
vlfcrews 2
Simple fix for Asiana and this one (Emirates). You rarely need two hands on the yoke. One hand on the yoke, one hand on the throttles until you are established in a long-term power position (i.e. Take-off, go-around or climb thrust). Whether you are using auto-throttle or not, you need to anticipate that the throttles are going to move if the yoke moves, if they don't, you need to make them. That is what makes Boeing better than Airbus, you can see what the autopilot & autothrottle or other pilot is doing.
Cadefoster
Cade foster 0
I think its also the culture we live in today that is so adverse to laying blame, responsibility on the "person". If there is even 1 percent cause not directly associated with individual, then direct the blame on the the object, or system or whatever else isn't the human being. i.e. don't blame the person blame the gun.....

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